Squid Game Really Took It Out of Me (Squid Game)

Rosey: 0:07

Welcome back, everyone.

Avery: 0:09

Welcome to really important fictional thing. week two,

Rosey: 0:12

week two we are I mean, it's like embarrassing how excited we are and yeah,

Avery: 0:18

I feel like the tone of my voice is gonna be completely different in this episode because I'm just pumped to be here.

Rosey: 0:23

They can't wait to hear it. Everyone's excited. How's your life? How's your week?

Avery: 0:28

Izmail it's been like really insane. For my second paper in grad school ever I submitted it with seven minutes

to 11: 0:36

53pm

Rosey: 0:39

lassic a right. Should we all tell everyone the story about AP English senior year?

Avery: 0:44

Oh my god, which

Rosey: 0:47

is good call. No, I immediately think of because it's benefited me too. We I don't know if you did you do Okay, so we all write papers on Hamlet. Yeah, to remember fucking you didn't. Or you were like two sentences.

Avery: 1:01

I wrote. I wrote an introductory paragraph. And I was like, I literally cannot spend any more of my life energy on this. I was fucking hated it. I think it's dumb. I have nothing to

Rosey: 1:12

say. This also shows our personality so well, because I wish I did that. Instead, I like toiled over a paper for a play that I couldn't stand. I literally wrote a version got like a C. He was like, you can try again. So I did and I got a C minus. And I was like, Yes, I can't write about Hamlet. I just wrote he was rotating love my writing. He was so funny to be around, but was like not great character. Anyway, so then later on, Avery convinced this teacher to just remove the lowest grade we had from our average.

Avery: 1:48

There's that what oh, no, no, no, I mean, kind of, but what the the argument was that he provided us a syllabus in the beginning of the year. That said, we were doing X amount of papers and X amount of quizzes and he gave us one extra paper. I think it was at least one and my argument was you lied to us. And as a result, we should be able to pick either one paper or two quizzes that we wanted to drop off our grade. And he was like,

Rosey: 2:16

fair. Anyway, so classic you fashion that still in grad school. Wait until the last second.

Avery: 2:22

Lat literally last? I

Rosey: 2:23

bet it's a great paper is okay.

Avery: 2:27

What else has been happening?

Rosey: 2:29

For me? I have a cold. You remember i all i Oh, I this was in the last episode. My darling niece. Let me hold her precious stuffed animal. But she had a cold. So I think that this stuff, they will also have it cold. I mean, I also put her to bed stuffed animal also had a cold animal. They gave it to me. No blame on Maggie. Yeah, so I've got a cold. It could be worse. It's fine. Otherwise, lots of meetings this week. Oh, I don't know if we'll keep this in. But I'm doing training to be a mentor for foster youth. Fascinating. Good. times. We did a roleplay I was really nervous. I hope I get through that was still I still am not officially like on the list.

Avery: 3:12

I mean, I guarantee that you are better in that roleplay than like 95% of people.

Rosey: 3:18

Yeah. Yeah, they were. Thank you. I thought I did a great job. I'm

Avery: 3:27

very excited about it. Yeah. Well, you'll have to let us know how it goes. Yeah, I'll

Rosey: 3:30

keep everyone posted if I get approved. And then if I get approved negativity, I then like can't say anything about them ever. So you'll not hear about it. Okay. You'll know they exist. That's it. Um, so yeah. So that's how we're doing and now we'll jump into what we've watched. Yes.

Avery: 3:45

So I watched good again, it's gonna be the topic of the deep dive and we're gonna go into depth on it later today, because there's so much fucking going on you guys. There's so much going on. I can't even I'm so excited. I wrote like, I think do 1000 words about it. I'm not going to read all of them to you guys. But there's a lot going on. We were

Rosey: 4:03

gonna do a deep dive on something else. And then I got the texture maybe that was like so we're gonna have to change.

Avery: 4:10

Like, I have too many thoughts and feelings too many times.

Rosey: 4:14

Yeah, we'll talk about that other show. Feel good to hook you all in which everyone should watch anyway. And then when we talk about it, you'll you'll be on our level. So what I watched from the top 10 was known gets out alive. So that was the horror movie The turning the trailer we're basically not speaking so it did engage us unexpectedly. The trailer did anyway. I watched it. I hated it. I honestly, I mean, we saw that. We saw that coming. I will also preface that I'm not a horror like horror is not my genre. So if you're into horror, you might like it. It's a monster in the basement vibe. But you don't really know that you can just tell things are like not good. But it's basically 90 minutes of like, I can tell something's wrong, but we're not resolving it. We're just like aware of the fact that something's wrong. And I will Going into it,

Avery: 5:00

because it just tense where you just like I was just starting to test some of that brutality

Rosey: 5:05

at the end reminded me mid summer if anyone's mid summer like, yeah, some of those scenes like I can't get it out of my brain and I didn't need it.

Avery: 5:14

You don't need mid summer was funny. We saw that one together that I think

Rosey: 5:18

was a good like, that's a good horror movie. And it was so bright. We were also really high. I wasn't high you weren't? Oh you met up with us with a group and you shut up. I don't know if anyone else was, Oh, man. I'm sorry. Because it was a lot and I was sober.

Avery: 5:37

That scene where the old people jump off, but that's Oh, it will stay with me till

Rosey: 5:42

I die. Basically what happens in no one gets out alive. So I did do a little research. It got to 65% on Rotten Tomatoes. So I'm not like alone. Yeah. 5.3 out of 10 on IMDb. pretty low. It was also based on a book. And the only reason I bring that up is because the book was about working class people when the main character was a woman in the UK, but the movie is about immigrants in the US. So I did read a quote that stuck with me that said it. It explores real life horror of how undocumented immigrants are exploited using the horror movie construct that made me appreciate the movie a little more. That is definitely what they're doing a bunch of immigrant women who are undocumented, no one cares about them. Their boss is taking advantage of them. Other immigrants are taking advantage of them. Like one woman says she'll help her get a like papers, but just takes her money all the money she has, and then turns off her phone and like never. Oh my god response. Wow. And then literally spoiler if you are going to watch it, but at the end, the whole thing is that the two men who run the home that these women are in are feeding them like literally just giving them the heads like the woman's heads like that's what Oh, given to the monster in the basement. So she ends why just the heads that's all a monster wants. Also the monster took you out of the movie because it was like one of the work it was like, it was like hands for legs. It was like sort of a spider but also kind of a woman. It was like a very confusing being. I'm not sure what. I'm not sure for sure. Like something else. Just in the basement. Yeah, she ends up but if you give her the heads, yes, she loves you. Yeah, and she makes you like you should Okay, she's murdered a bunch of people at this point. She's trying to escape

Avery: 7:36

she murder them or did the guys murder them and give her the romance?

Rosey: 7:40

She murders the guys. Oh, good. But yeah, okay. She murderers. One of them. Who's the one you hate the most? He's way more violent. And he's the one feeding the people to this monster. The woman to the sponsor. The brother was a conflicting character because he kept being like, Oh, I'm sorry. So you're like, Oh, I think I feel bad for you. I don't feel bad for

Avery: 8:00

you. They were they both white? Yeah. Okay, sorry. Sorry. Yeah. Oh, no.

Rosey: 8:06

They're both white. Yeah. Probably in their 40s Men classic. Their dad was a murderer or murdered their mom. It's

Avery: 8:14

generated like

Rosey: 8:17

they are. So the older brother Becker keeps feet like bringing more women in and each time it's like this is the last time and the younger brothers like you helped me when I was little so I'll keep helping you. Like he feels very loyal to the older brother.

Avery: 8:30

Okay, but he keeps saying this is the last time and just keeps doing it. Yeah, younger brothers like this is I trust

Rosey: 8:35

you Yeah. I don't know why a younger brother still yes deluded. He also seems to think he also seems to think it's like not that bad. Because like no one's looking for these women.

Avery: 8:45

I mean, white men in their 40s Right. They're not really that worried about it. Or worried about

Rosey: 8:51

it. So the so the very end she's like about to be sacrificed. And she's fighting till the end. So she's she's a very interesting character and very tough, very cool. She's just like, I don't accept my reality. And then she brutally brutally murders the older guy, like, remind me of midsummer, you can't recognize his face. It's horrifying. I mean, it's a great like, you're very happy. Because there's one scene right before that, where he she's on the ground. He's pushed her down, and he stomps on her ankle like you hear it crack. So then she murders him. She's actually not doing this. She murdered him in a stealthy way too. There's like this weird sword thing that has a bunch of like, pieces coming out of it. She pulls one out, he grabbed a ring like that classic scene of a man like throwing a woman up against and she leans in and she immediately slices his throat open and then he's like bleeding out and she goes and gets the rest of the sword and then just like ghost him.

Avery: 9:47

Wow.

Rosey: 9:49

So then the she's about to leave that's really gory. It really gory but only gory in the last, like 15 minutes, which up until that point, there was no blood, None None So then the younger brother is like, at this point been beaten up, like turns out, he's still breathing. So they don't show how she gets into the basement. She gets into the basement to the monster sacrifices him. She's about to leave the house and she's like limping and there's dead women everywhere. It's like a horrifying scene. And she's like crying. And then she gets to the door and her ankle heals. And her cuts disappear. What? And then she just like stands there, expressionless and the movie is over. What so I think the whole idea is like, does she now start sacrificing people because the house seems silly, or the monster like protects the one who's feeding it? The house interesting, but literally, I'm watching it alone. It ends. And that's the scene and I'm just like, staring at the credits and I was like, I hate this. I hate it. It wasn't. We've talked a lot and I've talked about this before. It wasn't necessarily not good. All right, I just didn't like

Avery: 11:00

not a rosy

Rosey: 11:04

you're into horror it like it was interesting the way they did it. And they used a lot of tropes. Like I did feel scared like it was just feel scared doing what it was supposed to be doing. Wait, I'm assuming its goals. So

Avery: 11:15

fascinated by that ending? Also, that would have been

Rosey: 11:19

more interesting if that happened, like halfway through. And then we watched her struggle with like her own survival versus your mom.

Avery: 11:27

You want the TV version of this? Yeah, I want to know I I want

Rosey: 11:30

everything to be Yeah.

Avery: 11:34

You're like, this is the setup, guys. Yeah, this is a cold open.

Rosey: 11:38

Honestly, that's kind of how I felt.

Avery: 11:40

I feel like it's funny to me that you don't like horror, because I think I'm more than I mean, I guess liking and being able to withstand it. Yeah, two different things. But I think you have a higher tolerance than I do.

Rosey: 11:52

I have a fine totally. Honestly, a lot of the movies the horror movies end up watching. I'm like, were we scared? What I don't like I wasn't afraid. I think they mostly just it's just not my genre. I don't know like something about a little bored. Yeah, I think that's that's kind of it for our welcome. Should we dive into squid

Avery: 12:19

squid game.

Rosey: 12:21

I'm like excited. I'm nervous. I have a lot of emotion. Ready to go. Oh,

Avery: 12:25

my God. Yeah, it's everything the internet cracks it up to be and I would argue more. I think there's more going on. So I'm just going to tell you like what happened? Yeah. Spoilers, all the spoilers. Go watch it and then come back and listen. Yeah, exactly. So basically what it is at the top level, it's a survival show, I guess. It's a genre called survival show or something. It was sort of pioneered by this movie called Battle Royale, which came out in the 2000s. Also from Korea, the main character is this guy named Song Ji Hoon, Song Jun. I'm gonna butcher every name in this episode. So please let me know that I suck.

Rosey: 13:15

Share the correct one. Do that don't tell her to sex.

Avery: 13:21

So some Gian is the main character. He is introduced as like, basically a deadbeat. He's like in his 40s he lives with his mom. He's a gambling addict. He's a father. But he like can't even like Get it together enough to buy his daughter a birthday present. Like he's presented as just like a loser. Right? He gets approached by this guy, this like very clean cut business guy in the subway and is like, if you'll play this random little game with me, I'll give you 100 bucks. I think it's like $100. That equates to $100 every time you win. But if I win, I get to slap you in the face. She's and he's just lost a bunch of money. And he's like, in serious debt. Like he is being like, hunted basically for the money that he owes these gangsters. And so he's like, Sure, let's do it. So they play this game. And I won't go into it. But it's very basic. And he keeps losing over and over and over and the guy keeps slapping him in the face. Like he's, it's like all red like that. And then finally he wins. And he goes up the other guy in the face and the guy puts the money up in front of him. And he's like, Here you go. This is what you won. And he's like, oh, yeah, the money like he forgot. Yeah, you know. And then a guy had hands in this business card and is like, if you want to do like more of this basically call this number. And he's like, okay, so he calls the number and they're inviting him to this. Like, they don't tell him what it is. But they tell him he can come to this game and try to win money or whatever. And he's like, okay, cool. I'll do it. And he gets picked up by this van with like six other people in it and they get gassed and go to sleep. They wake up in this. I mean, it looks like a prison like it's just this like this is what we saw in the trailer. Yeah. Everything's on the trailer. Yeah, they wake up in that weird barracks room or whatever. And then the people are like, you're gonna play children's games and whoever wins gets to move on. There's gonna be six of them. And if you get all the way to the end, you get money. So they start this first game, and it's called red light, green light. And you you've

Rosey: 15:21

made that yeah, I can picture we played in Girl Scouts, so very different energy. Yeah.

Avery: 15:26

Yeah. But it starts out like you're literally in a kid's playground. Like there's a doll that's calling out red light, green light. And if it sees you moving, when it turns says red light, you you're out is what they set you loose. So they start playing it. And it's just like normal. They don't know what's going on in the first red light happens. And obviously, there's like 450 players, 456 players, and the first red light happens and a bunch of them are still moving. And then they just get shot. And we saw this in the trailer. So they just get fucking massacred. But they're in the middle of a red light green light game, so they have to freeze, even though they're in the process of realizing what's happened with

Rosey: 16:05

God. So they all see someone get shot, but they can't now move a reaction anyway, because then they'll also be shot.

Avery: 16:10

Exactly. They have to sign player consent form. And there's three clauses in them. The first one is that the players are not allowed to stop playing the game. Or they're out. Or they're out.

Rosey: 16:22

Okay, murdered. Yeah. Casual. What was the second one? The second one, it was the majority thing. The majority is the third one. Okay, the second one seems. So the first one is same? Uh, yeah, it sounds like it's played. Yeah, it says, the first clause says that the player is not allowed to stop playing. And the second says that the player who refuses to play will be eliminated. So I guess that's like, if there's one rule like, I'm not quitting altogether, but I'm not doing this one. Yeah, you're still killed. Got it. I can't refuse

Avery: 16:52

the whole game. And if you stop in the middle of a game, you will be eliminated. And then the third one is, at any point, if the majority of players want to end the game, it ends. Yeah. Those are the three rules. And they make you sign that contract before you know what the fuck you're doing.

Rosey: 17:08

And what I just read to set. It doesn't even say players it just says the majority. So then it's like the majority of who?

Avery: 17:15

Rosie, you found that on? I found it on a law blog. That's the thing about this show. There's like so much. There's so many elements of it that are so interesting to so many different parts of society. Yeah, it doesn't surprise me at all that a law blog was like, let me write about this

Rosey: 17:29

lawyer was like my daughter was into it. So I sat down and then was like, What is?

Avery: 17:33

This is a legal?

Rosey: 17:36

Definitely, yes.

Avery: 17:39

Okay, so then they get into red light, green light, they realize that it's a massacre, they get back to the room, and they're just like fog. Yeah, they immediately decide to take a vote. And they end up ending the game.

Rosey: 17:53

Okay. I didn't expect that. Yeah. And so they

Avery: 17:57

all leave. Then they get back into the real world. And you see one after another, like your seven main characters that they follow. Each of them, their life is so shitty on the outside, that they decide to go back? Oh, my God. So they call the number again. And the number is like, if you want to come back, meet us at x plays that X time. It's up to you. Like it's free choice. And they all go back.

Rosey: 18:22

That's what so that's what I feel like isn't easy to explain. So it sounds like the show is is showing it which is always easier than telling Yeah. But like, people don't like their I feel like they're responsible for someone who's homeless, for example, like why don't they just get a job? Right? You don't understand the reality of their world. So to say that, like their reality is so hard or painful or difficult or whatever, that they're choosing? Almost. Definitely. Death. Yeah. Instead is like,

Avery: 18:56

says a lot. Whoa, yeah. And that's like the, that's the obvious triangle of the show. And the critique is like, saying that things have gotten so bad in the Korean economy and the global economy at large that this is a viable option. Like one of the articles I did a bunch of reading of what other people are saying and one of the articles was like, maybe two or three years ago. Let me back up. In the guy who wrote me this, the show started writing in 2008 and didn't get picked up for Netflix until 2019. He says that he thinks one of the reasons why it didn't get picked up before is because it felt so fantastical like people were saying like this, this just doesn't feel realistic at all people won't be able to connect with it. But now in the fucking upside down that we live in with COVID and Trump and like all of the shit that's happening like with the environment, not to be a huge downer right now. But it just feels less crazy. Like I still don't think it's a realistic idea to like have The Secret played of the death game, but I don't know, maybe it is. I mean, yeah,

Rosey: 20:04

it feels like not impossible to wrap your head around.

Avery: 20:09

Yeah, it's just the rules are not being followed the way that they we perceived them to have been in the past. So anyway, so they all leave the game, then they go back because their lives are so shitty. And they just keep playing these games. And each one of them is just more and more and more traumatic. Because what they start doing is they don't tell you the rules of the game until you start playing. But they'll make you do things like for one of them. They make you choose a partner before they tell you what the game is. And so that they're like, Okay, well, we want to choose a partner that complements me, right? Like, if I'm really smart, I want to choose someone that's really strong. And at this point, I think this is like the third or fourth game at this point they've bonded to of course, so

Rosey: 20:52

they're like, I'm gonna ask they're like, because they're like sleeping in the same place eating together. Yeah, I'm not becoming

Avery: 20:57

a thing. It's like, there's so many. There's like prison dynamics that come into it, too. Yeah. But so they pick people that they trust that they think that will actually be on their side, then they find out that they're playing against each other. Of course

Rosey: 21:08

they are.

Avery: 21:11

You see, it's so one of them the second till I think it's the second to last game, they have to cross a bridge. And there are two pieces of glass next to each other along the way. Like those are the steps on the bridge, one of them you will fall through and die. And the other one will support your weight, but you can't tell which is which. And to the before the game, they have to pick numbers. And they find out when they get to the bridge. The number is the order that they're going to be walking across the bridge.

Rosey: 21:38

But they mean the number almost doesn't matter. Because they don't know. It matters because it corresponds but they don't know like that three is good. And exactly. Yeah, exactly. So

Avery: 21:47

they're just they're basically gambling, they have no idea what the numbers mean, then they get to the bridge. And they realize like number one, ASCO first one is definitely going to die, because they're just taking random guesses on the glass. So So then it turns into this weird thing where like, the people at the front are sacrifices for the people at the back to live. Because they're the ones that are literally testing out the glass as they go. And then the ones behind them benefit from

Rosey: 22:14

it. Yeah, cuz then you know which ones to skip?

Avery: 22:16

It's insane. So wait, I have so many questions,

Rosey: 22:21

but I know you're gonna say more stuff do so they bond which we'll talk more about in a second. Are there people that they don't like? Yeah, like, there must be conflict too,

Avery: 22:29

so much conflict. And because of that, they find it so every time. Every time a character dies, they add to the pot of the money that you can win.

Rosey: 22:41

Okay, so it was gonna ask,

Avery: 22:42

you know how much money it is? Yeah, it's it ends up being like $38 million total. But but it's representative. It's, it's depend on each character's life, like the money is tied to each character is worth an X amount of money. And then it all adds up to around 38,000. I just keep thinking

Rosey: 22:58

through insurance, like, Well, yes.

Avery: 23:00

Like how much is a life worth. So they find out that the pot gets bigger every time someone dies. And I don't remember how it happens. But someone dies outside of a game like is killed or something. And then you hear that, like the money dropping in. And you can see there's a there's like a sign telling you how much money is in the pot and you see it go up. And so then they all realize that the characters can die at any point, and that their money will go into the pot. So what starts happening is people start trying to kill each other outside of the game.

Rosey: 23:33

So we when you say outside of the game, that just means they're they're not like children home and then coming back.

Avery: 23:39

Oh, they're stuck in this prison. Right? So they go to have one of the children's games and then they come back and they're just like spending the night in this. It literally looks like a prison. They do it on purpose. Yeah,

Rosey: 23:48

the you find out that? Well. Yeah, it makes sense that they will do it on purpose.

Avery: 23:52

Yeah, it's all just like a psychological mindfuck. So what ends up happening is they start like, basically forming prison gangs, and like forming alliances and then the first night when the lights go off. There's just a massive riot. And they just, like kill as many people as they possibly some of them do. As many people Yeah, sure.

Rosey: 24:11

Were you watching it? I mean, I feel like when I watch anything like this, I can't help but be like, like, I'd watch that just being like, I think I just die. Like, I don't know, do you watch any thinking like how would I do in this game? Or were you so absorbed that you were just watching it? There impossible situation? Yeah. So you don't really know you don't

Avery: 24:30

do you don't really know. And the main character, his whole thing is that he's like, very empathetic, and you find out the he's set up as this loser character, but you'd find out later that he used to be a successful businessman, or he wasn't a businessman. He used to be a successful worker. He worked at a auto plant in Korea and I guess I think this is based on a real thing. The owners of the plant shut it down with no warning and just laid off everybody with no like severance or anything cool. And instead of goal instead of just Like taking it lying down, the workers staged a sit in and refuse to leave. And it was like it got violence. Okay, and so you find out that that was his background and ever since then he's been poor. And as a result, he divorced his wife, and now he's gambling addict, because the other thing is, he's a gambling addict, but he doesn't really seem to care about money. He does it because he's depressed. And it's a rush of life. Well, and also also comes back later.

Rosey: 25:25

Yeah, what was gonna say with also with that background? Basically, this life he was living that he thought he had some control over turned out he didn't. So I feel like gambling is definitely a form of control. I mean, all addictions, really, but it's like, okay, well, nothing matters. And there is no rhyme or reason to this. So like, let's just see. Yeah, I don't believe in anything anymore. Anyway. So let's just see what happens.

Avery: 25:48

Absolutely. And that's gonna come back at the end, so that you imperfectly encapsulated basically the heart of this and I didn't even see it. Yeah. So the show is this nihilistic nothing matters. Let's just have fun and see what happens. Let's gamble thing versus this empathetic human beings matter. More like there's more at stake than capitalism and money, and there's meaning to life. And literally, the show is just like going back and forth. And it doesn't it doesn't make any satisfying conclusions. Like it's not coming out saying like, no life does mean something or No, it doesn't mean anything. It's like, it holds the tension there really well and doesn't answer any of those questions. Similarly to how it doesn't really answer any questions about, like, whether capitalism is bad, or whether communism is bad, or collectivism or anything like it doesn't offer any solutions. So going back to what you're saying about like, did I spend the whole thing wondering how I would make those decisions? Yes. But also, it's, it's like kind of beside the point, because they're, you're so out of control of anything, that the choices you make don't matter. Yeah, like the the partner that you pick really doesn't matter. Because you don't know why, or the number that you pick doesn't matter. Because you don't even know why you're picking that number. Like, it's the probabilities of your choices, you have no way of calculating what is a better choice than another. Cool.

Rosey: 27:10

It's just like, I mean, like, I would like to think there's a little more control we have in life, but that's like sort of life, I mean, not with the same steak of like, you're picking a number, and then that number turns out, you're stepping onto glass and you fall to your death. Right? But like, there are a lot of decisions, we all make that like, I don't know, or something I don't know, like, runs a red light, and everything's fine. Or they run a red light, and they're T boned. And that's the end. Like, we're just, yeah, it's really scary. But in other ways, I feel like you have to look at it as just sort of like, freeing like, Okay, well just go after things that you do. Yeah. Or about them? Because you have very little control here. Yeah,

Avery: 27:50

absolutely. Yeah. And that also comes back to another major theme of the show, which is individualism versus collectivism. And are you making choices based on what you think is right? Or what you think is right for the group?

Rosey: 28:02

Yeah, what you think is right for yourself or the group? Exactly. Yeah. Keep going. I can't wait to your other sense.

Avery: 28:07

I know I'm gonna finish the plot. And we'll come back. Yeah. So about I think about halfway through the show you realize you get started to get you start meeting the people that are running the show, right? First, you meet the prisoners like the or I'm sorry, the prison guards. The guys that were dressed in, like the pink jumpsuits, they're the ones that literally like just keep the prisoners in line and bring them back and forth to places

Rosey: 28:29

they all men.

Avery: 28:32

You don't see anyone okay. And they all speak in a male voice. But the

Rosey: 28:36

prisoners are men and women men and women. Yeah. Are there children? Or is it all?

Avery: 28:42

No children, all adults? I think the youngest one is I think she's 17. Okay, and I don't know what the age of majority is in Korea. I haven't either. But um, anyway, so you start to you start to see what these prison guards and you think they're like these inhuman robots because they're covered in their masks or whatever. And who could possibly be this callous? Right? They're just like, gunning down people for like, arbitrary reasons. And one of the one of the prisoners revolts when he's about to get killed and he's like, show me your face show me your face and the guy takes off his mask and it's like a 16 year old boy

Rosey: 29:21

yeah, oh my god. Yeah. And he

Avery: 29:23

looks exactly like the prisoners like it's just like a person like a human. Okay. And you realize that the guards are also in this like situation where if they disobey like they will be killed? Oh, yeah. She's I don't know how they got there. They never really explained how they got there.

Rosey: 29:42

Were probably some sort of similar manipulation with not a lot of info

Avery: 29:45

probably. Yeah, exactly. Probably desperate people that need some sort of protection or

Rosey: 29:50

they were just told it was a job instead of a game or something.

Avery: 29:53

There's also shady shit going on there like they're they're taking the bodies and like harvesting their organs, selling them to make extra money on the side. And they're using one of the prisoners who's a doctor to do it. So they take him away.

Rosey: 30:07

It's insane. tell anybody? No, because

Avery: 30:09

the what they're giving him is they'll tell him what the next game is. So he has that information. is crazy.

Rosey: 30:19

I think you're getting there. But do you meet the people pulling the strings? Yes.

Avery: 30:23

Okay, so about halfway through. First you see the guards. And then after that there's this one mysterious figure that's masked. And he has like the geometric mask. Do you remember seeing him? It's all black. Yeah, he's the even know what they call him. But he's the one like running the games. Basically. He's in charge. He's a manager. And you start seeing more of him like taking phone calls from someone up high or whatever. And like setting things up and trying to they realize there's an intruder and he's like, trying to look for the police intruder guy. And then I think it's the third to last episode. It's the one with the bridge. You see him receiving VIPs. And these guys walk in with these gold masks. And they're all different animals. They're like, Bear. There's a bear. There's a cougar. There's like a bunch of different animals. So if anybody knows what the symbolism of is, of those masks, please write in and tell us because I have no idea. I was like, is it the zodiac? I have no idea. Okay, so the VIPs come? They I think they're all white. There might be one Asian but they're all coated white. And you realize that they've been betting on these games. They're being broadcast around the world and these like rich people are placing bets on these guys as if their horses

Rosey: 31:32

disease when when these reveals happen when you're watching it. Are they surprising? Yeah, each twist. You're like

Avery: 31:37

what? Yes. I mean, it's not as much my reaction was not like shock because everything is so fucking weird. But they they peel back the layers of the onion in a really good way where like, you just

Rosey: 31:49

Yeah, it was like just hearing it said out loud. I'm like, of course they were doing that. But I'm still watching. I wouldn't be like, I bet there's people betting, you know, like, Yeah, didn't jump there. But it like, makes sense. Like, it's following the theme of the show. It's following

Avery: 32:02

the theme. And also, it's just like so classically well done in terms of movies and TV, because like all the themes that are set up in the beginning, not even themes, but like actual things that happened in the beginning combat. Like he's, he's betting on a horse game in the beginning. And then it turns out that he's being bet on as a horse. There's like a lot of parallels. There's even like, he tries in ATM code at the beginning and then that ATM code comes back. Like there's a lot of really well crafted like real so well crafted, the craft of screenwriting here is really strong. And that's from the that's the background of the of the filmmaker, which I will get to in a second. Okay, so you find out that these ultra rich, psychopathic narcissist are voting on this reality TV show, which is actually humans murdering each other, they all come so that they can witness they're the VIPs they want to witness the games in person. So you've there's the bridge is set up behind like a two way mirror and they literally are sitting there watching all this happen live there in this like, crazy room, I should show you a picture of it. But you it's covered in like what you think is furniture with different patterns on it. And they're like animal prints. And you realize are actually humans being used as furniture,

Rosey: 33:25

or these new other humans just wrapped

Avery: 33:27

up. They never address them. They never even then they Oh doesn't sit right down on there. They're They're frozen. Yeah, they sit on them. There's one behind the worst guy that's a woman with her boobs out and she's holding her boobs up so he can lay back on her chest. But they're just like frozen. And like that's the other thing about this show. This show is dead. This is the part where you start realizing that it's also a commentary on globalization and racism throughout the world. Because the people that are coming in and voting on this are white. Most of them are American, one of them is explicitly southern. I think one of them is like Russians other like Southern American, Southern American. Yeah, like an old plantation owner. Like that's the guy that speaks the most and then the I think there's like one Russian and there may be one English guy,

Rosey: 34:11

what kind of feelings are you having? Like, are you getting angry? Or are you just like along for this ride?

Avery: 34:17

So the show does a really good job of putting enough emotional distance for the most part between like putting enough satire in it and enough like whimsy almost that you don't feel completely in the real world, which helps you watch it like got it. Even the set designs like they're so bizarre like of the kids playgrounds and like the Willy Wonka land or whatever, like it adds this element of otherworldly toughness to it, that you can kind of disconnect from it, but that ends up that goes away the further that you get, like in the beginning, people are getting getting killed and you're kind of just like, What the fuck is going on? Yeah, sure. And even the characters that you're following are kind of like it's just sold czar that they're not really connecting to it and then by like the last two games, two or three games, that's when it started to get really hard as you know that people, you know the people they know each other so you're watching them, deal with it. It's it's tough. Are

Rosey: 35:15

you hoping? Do you have any kind of I mean, you don't want to die. You don't want anyone to die. You're like, I just want you all to somehow find a way to get out of this.

Avery: 35:24

The one character that is like heart of gold, like untouchable, good person gets murdered in that one where you have to be with your partner. He's, uh, that's okay. He's really cool, too. He's a Pakistani immigrant speaks Korean.

Rosey: 35:36

Very cool.

Avery: 35:37

I've never seen I'm not an expert in Korean cinema. But I've seen a decent amount of it. And I have not seen a person of color. In a Korean film, like a person of not Korean. Yeah, yeah. In this case, it's a person of color to them. Yeah. Of course. Yeah.

Rosey: 35:54

Do are there normally white people in the stuff you've seen?

Avery: 35:57

Um, I don't think so. Yeah, there's just not a lot of it's just diversity. Right? Yeah. And I was doing some research on it. And I guess that is still a big thing. And I, I read one article by an actual native Korean filmmaker. And he said that that's still a big thing in Korea is like this, this rite of blood, that being Korean is being the like having Korean blood, which is really interesting. That's really interesting. So Pakistani immigrant is like the first guy to get killed that you're like,

Rosey: 36:27

Oh, my God, before that. You're just sort of like, I just am not getting into like, I'm not attached to people in this large group. Yeah, exactly. And that's like, that hole isn't stolen. Who says it? But like, one death is a tragedy and 1000 is a statistic or something. I forget the numbers, but it's literally like a bunch of people that you like, can't process. Yeah, but if it's one person, whether you know them or not, it feels way sadder. Way more real, really interesting. Yeah, that's a very abstract quote. But yeah. Just to put that out there.

Avery: 36:57

No, that's really applicable. And he's like, the only character that is just like a love through and through. So of course, they kill him off pretty early. And oh, my God, one of the partners, one of the pairs are husband and wife,

Rosey: 37:09

oh, my god,

Avery: 37:11

he kills his wife. And then he hangs himself. And then Oh, my God, that's when it started to get really dark. And you're like,

Rosey: 37:19

that's just stuff I have such a hard time watching. Like, I mean, through this whole conversation, there's clearly so much it's like, commenting on and exploring, and like, I totally see the value in all of that. Yeah. And we talked about this last time, and obviously, it'll come up it's old theme in the podcast, but like, how fictional things are shaping culture and everything? Yeah. So I feel like the hardest one of the things I totally struggle with is that I'm like, but how much personal pain? Do I want to be in? To like, see, to like, like, do I need to watch this and feel that pain to get what's being said? And like, oftentimes, sort of, yeah, like, I think unless you watch the whole thing, or some of it, you're not really going to get what it like the point that it's trying to make. But I struggle with that constantly. Like, I don't really want to sit through those feelings. Yeah.

Avery: 38:05

I mean, and that is completely valid. Yeah, people watch TV and movies for different reasons. And like you're doing the work in ways that in a different way that are makes sense for you. And you are one of the people that I know that is doing the most work in that arena. So like, if you if you want to take a break from that work, and just chill and watch Bobby's world, like that's fine.

Rosey: 38:26

And I usually enjoy it when I watch I mean, it's just an interesting thing to hold both things like what what am I gonna dive in, but okay. Oh my god.

Avery: 38:33

Yeah. Oh, we haven't even I don't know. Okay, the thing that I want to say about the furniture though, is that it the human for the heat, it's human furniture that is painted in animal prints, like leopard prints and stuff. And it just had me thinking about how humans are used as literal disposal resources for our globalized economy. And also that we it's we we use people from underdeveloped places to support our globalized economy in first world so like we got so many of our of our natural resources out of Africa and the amount of people that are being murdered in Africa for like the black market like precious metals trade so that we can have iPhones

Rosey: 39:27

yeah well, because I looked at it been like what so I mean, I feel like what this show is doing but what's so hard about that is like when you phrase it that like take my phone back I don't take away yeah, well that but that's not what we're all in this society. We're like, a phone and now we're trapped whether

Avery: 39:48

or not your jority I can it and the majority okay. And that also yes, and the majority so that is another thing is like it's a it's a critique of democracy because we are presented with this option that we have control, right? But really we don't. Because the game the people that are setting the rules are above the democracy.

Rosey: 40:10

They're not even participating in this. They're

Avery: 40:12

not participating in it. Well, that comes back. But they're generally not participating in it. They're setting up the rules. And then they're giving us these things that they're setting up to us as human rights. But really, they're just granting us permission to have this I want

Rosey: 40:28

them to have to play the game do they have to play the kick comes up.

Avery: 40:32

So then they get through the bridge. A bunch of people die. One of the main characters that we love gets like, slapped Like, seriously injured and is going to die that night. The Jihun the main character is like you're not gonna die like we'll get you medical help, whatever. The third third guy who's June's front like childhood friend murders that girl, because he's like, she was going to die anyway, let's just get to the end of this. And so that then they're at the final game, okay, it was just him in his red hat. And it's just him and his friend, there's two. And I'll get back to how they knew each other but it's June and song when and they were childhood friends. June is a loser song when went to like this very prestigious university became like a very high paid businessman and was supposed to have gotten out but ended up stealing money from all of his clients and getting into massive debts. So even though one of them was supposedly pulled himself out there, they end up in the same place. And at this point, you Hoon is like your fucking psychopath. I can't believe like, you're the terrible person, whatever. Like, he's like, I'm gonna fucking kill you. So they get to this final game. The final game is the squid game. Okay, which I'm not going to really explain. But it's like a street game. It's really physical and a

Rosey: 41:45

lot of articles. If you want to read about it. There's I just tried to come up with it of the

Avery: 41:50

rules. Yeah, yeah. It's just super physical. And they're basically there's an offense and a defense. The offense is trying to get to a certain place on the court, the defense is trying to get them out of the court altogether. If the offense wins, the defense dies. If the defense wants often sets, whatever, they get to pick their positions, they flip a coin. Okay? Again, just again, yeah. The and it's funny because Gio, and the whole time has been like, really meticulous about like, he's just conflicted, the whole time conflicted about what choices he's gonna make, like, he ends up going last on the bridge, because he just couldn't decide what he wanted to do. But he ended up being the safest, safest one. Yeah, it's crazy. So it just turns into a fistfight, like literally a physical fight until the death and at the end, June is going to win, but he can't bring himself to do it. And so he turns to the garden, he says, We can end the game, right? If we choose to vote, do it at this point. And the friends like you came this far, you're gonna you're just gonna walk away from $38 million and end the game right now. Because you don't want to kill me. And God was like, Yeah, we don't need let's just go home. Let's just go home and like, be friends again. And the guy slits his throat. His older friends let's his own throat. Oh, yeah.

Rosey: 43:05

I have goosebumps is that like, what? Okay, what happens? Okay, so then he wins, he wins to just get some money and like, he gets

Avery: 43:11

some money in your life, and they just eject him back out into the world.

Rosey: 43:15

Do you see anybody else's? Like what happens? Everybody else,

Avery: 43:17

every time someone dies, they bring in this huge black coffin with a pink bow on it, put them in the coffin and then incinerate them.

Rosey: 43:28

Okay. So he's one, so he's one can go support his family now? Yeah, whatever. So he

Avery: 43:35

goes out into the world. And he gets he, he, they toss him out onto the road. And he coughs up a gold ATM card. And he goes to the ATM, he puts it in, he tries the same pin that he had in the beginning. Because the other thing is that they they've been watching them the whole time. Like in their real lives, he drives the same pin, it comes up, he has $38 million in his account. And then it's one year later. And he's like a bum like, he looks like a homeless person. And he's on the train. And he goes to his goes to this bank. And the banker is like you open an account with us with a lot of money a year ago, but you haven't touched it at all. And we just want to let you know that like, your money is just sitting there and it could be making you money. We're here for you if you want to, like invest. And he just gets up and he's like, can I borrow $10 for the bus? And the guy's like, yeah, of course. Like let me give you $10 Because he's rich now. Whatever they want, right? Yeah. And he just leaves and clearly like he can't bring himself to use it because

Rosey: 44:30

it's literally Blood Money literally blood money.

Avery: 44:33

It's the lives of these people that he became friends with. So he doesn't even touch it and then and then that Cheney what happens? Oh, he's he's getting drunk and sitting on like a river or something. And this old woman that's selling flowers comes up and says do you want to buy a flower? If you don't buy them tonight they're gonna wither away and I will waste my money. So he gives her the $10 which he had asked for for bus fare. And he gets a flower. There's a there's an envelope he open And it's another card for the game to play again, to play again. So well we think it's playing Yeah. But he calls and there's a message being like meet me at like this skyscraper at at 1130 this night or whatever. So he goes, he doesn't know what he's going for. And oh my god, I missed a whole thing. Hold on. So there's the first player player one in the games is an old man who has a brain tumor. And he was, June becomes like friends with him because he's like, trying to take care of this old man. And he like, doesn't want him to, like, get taken advantage of basically, the main the old man was the the final vote for the first time when they were like, do we want to end the game? He was the final vote. And he chose Yes. And and in the beginning, he's like, I'm just happy to be here. Like, what else? Am I doing whatever. And I thought that they were setting it up as like, this is the older generation that made all these choices to put us in the shitty place that we're at now. Now they just get to die and they don't have to worry about it. And they just had the fun of setting it up. I thought that was the setup. But then when he's the tie breaking vote for ending the game, I was like, oh, maybe not. Maybe they're trying to say like, we should respect our elders and they didn't know what they were doing. Then when he comes back in June become friends. June has to kill him in the paired game. Whoa. But Jihoon was about to die there was like they're like doing marbles or whatever June was about to lose. And the old guy pretends this is Brain Tumor acts up and he lets June when, okay, like that. He's gotten confused. That's June when and then he gets killed. You see it off screen. And so you think he was like this old man and you're supposed to respect your elders and take care of weak people, like they will help you. Then at the end, he goes to the skyscraper to meet the guy. It's the old man. He's been running the whole place and running the whole thing. He set up the game, he created it. He created the game.

Rosey: 46:50

That's insane. Yeah. And Jihoon is like, What the Why did you do obviously this I'm a brain tumor.

Avery: 46:55

He does actually. Oh, so he's, he's like, why did you create it? And why did you participate? He said, I created it, because I made so much money, that nothing mattered in life anymore. And I was bored all the time. He was like, if you have no money, or you have too much money, you're in the same place like nothing matters. I've heard that before. Yeah. So he's like, I got together with all my buddies that have a bunch of money. And we were like, how can we have some fun? And this is what we came up with this game. Yeah. And all those VIPs were like his buddies that, that shirt that watch the game together. And then he was like, Well, why did you participate? And he was like, Well, I actually do have a brain tumor. And it's way more fun to play than it is to watch. So we wanted the rush of actually, which again, is a huge metaphor for like, we kind of as humans are designed for this rat race. Like we like it. That's why capitalism works. It doesn't work, but why and why it

Rosey: 47:49

exists and why we all keep playing. Like why you keep playing the game.

Avery: 47:53

Yeah. And it's bizarre because Jihoon is obviously like, so angry at him. And I couldn't feel angry at him. Oh, I couldn't feel it. Like I don't know is something about the way he was expressing things. He was just so nihilistic, I guess, and Jihoon was was the opposite. So those are the two like writing. And there's a homeless guy on the street outside and the old guys like let's make one more bet if somebody goes and helps him before midnight, you win, but if they don't, I win. And at the very minute, like 30 seconds before the very last minute, somebody goes to help the guy and uns like, Fuck you, old man. And old man has died.

Rosey: 48:31

Like his brain tumor took them in those

Avery: 48:34

moments. Yeah.

Rosey: 48:35

Oh my god. So is that the end?

Avery: 48:39

No. So So after that, when this we're getting really close, so I'm just laughing because there's so much I mean, that's, that's only seven episodes. There's so much packed into it. But that's the only thing about the craft of it like it's so it's so lean, that you really can get all of this in one thing. So then at the very end, after that happened, you Hoon basically seems to be like, Okay, well, now I'm just going to use this money because a little bit has nihilism has like I need to stop being so idealistic, basically. And he takes all this money. And he goes to find one of the women in the game that he became friends with was from North Korea, and she had a brother who's just like, at a homeless shelter now. And she made June promise to take care of him. So June basically takes all his money. He dyes his hair red for some reason, probably because he thinks that nothing matters anymore. He takes all the money he got he gets the little boy, he brings the little boy to Song lose mom. And he's basically like, take care of him and leaves the money with her. And then he becomes a businessman. You see, like a flash forward, and he's a businessman making money and he's doing fine. He's just living

Rosey: 49:39

he gave all the money away and then just built his own life. Yeah, are a huge part

Avery: 49:43

of it. Yeah, sure. And, and you think the game is over, but he's in the subway, and he sees that same businessman, like playing the same game from the beginning with another random guy, just laughing thing, this lapping thing. And so he goes over to the guy and he's like, Oh, my God, you can't do it. Oh, and he takes the card from him and Then he calls the game back. And he's like, I'm not a horse, like I'm a person you have to treat me with you have to stop doing this. You have to treat people with respect, whatever. And the the voice on the on the line is like, you just have to get on the plane because he's like boarding a plane. So you see, okay, there's still water. So watching him. And instead of getting on the plane, he turns around and walks out. And that's the last scene. So it's like, very unclear. Yeah.

Rosey: 50:22

Which I feel like, how was that going to? That show couldn't end with some definitive like, no

Avery: 50:26

thing. But it's cool, because it is like, sort of an open end for a season to if they want to do Yeah, that's

Rosey: 50:31

true. And it also is, I mean, it's something I guess you'd use the word positive that he's like, Yeah, I'm turning. I'm not going that way. Yeah, do the thing I want to do he's trying to do or I'm gonna not do the thing you just told me? Yes, I want to do it doesn't matter. I'm just gonna not please you. He's trying

Avery: 50:49

to walk a very fine line, as the show is, like I've mentioned of finding a way to live morally, in an immoral world and an immoral system. Yep. Like how to maintain his humanity in the face of this. And this show doesn't answer if that's possible. The show just basically is like, Oh, you just got to ignore it?

Rosey: 51:09

Well, that's also the question that we all I mean, each person has to decide that for themselves, like that can't really be answered.

Avery: 51:14

Yeah. And we kind of all just have to, like self delude

Rosey: 51:18

to get through the day. And it sounds like I mean, what he leaned on, like, the nihilism or the empathy also changes in the moment, just to see whatever

Avery: 51:29

is going on. Yes. Okay. I'm gonna, Can I fly through? I know, we've talked a lot. But I have a few more minutes. I have like high level concepts that are coming up the idea of the sunk cost fallacy. Have you heard of that? Yeah. So for people that don't know, is our human tendency to follow through on an endeavor if we have already invested time. And that's what the players end up doing? time, effort or money. Every time they're like, we've come this far. Like, why would we stop the game now? Like, we have to see it thrill like, do you? Do you like you can just walk away? You could

Rosey: 52:01

just walk away? I mean, I kept the I mean, I didn't think that was going to happen, because that wouldn't be how the show would work or function. But you keep thinking like, yeah, I totally understand that concept of saying, like, X amount of people have already died. If we stop that's like in vain. But you're like, sure, but if you keep going more people die, like that's a given. Like, that is definitely going to happen. So. But I mean, that happens, obviously, even when it's not like life or death, just in any project. You're like, just because we did this for a year doesn't mean it's like the right call. Yeah, yeah.

Avery: 52:34

Yep. Oh, I loved the idea of that of the game and the beginning of the slap game, and how, like, the cost for a worker is actually so much higher than the cost for the person paying them. Like the exchange rate of labor versus money. And does not. We think it's a one to one and it's not.

Rosey: 53:00

No, I mean, I was thinking about that when you were talking about that. The slapping because I wanted to be like, How many times did he get slapped? Probably like, 100 times? And then he got $100. Yeah, because he only won once. Yes. And then the game was over. Because, look, we're done now. And it's

Avery: 53:17

the whole carrot and stick of capitalism. That is an illusion, which is that if you work hard enough, and you try for long enough, you will win like you have, yeah, do have they give you again, they give you an option. So you feel like you're free, and you're in control. But you're not you're a puppet. Gender stuff is really weird. There's like a lot of explicit conversation about how people don't want to be in teams with women, but they don't really talk about why and like, there's one really cool female character, the one from North Korea, who gets physical with a man in the beginning, but then isn't chosen for physical games, and the show doesn't really even touch that.

Rosey: 53:53

I mean, that's an interesting thing to not even touch because I think a lot of that stuff, because I mean, it's like kind of unconscious bias. Like sometimes you don't even know like, you can't even talk about it. Yeah, can't explain why you're feeling like more comfortable one person than another. So I don't know if that was intentionally left out, or if it was left out. But like, that's definitely a thing that comes up. We were like, I feel like I want you as a partner. But I don't know why I don't want them as a partner, but I don't for some reason. So that's

Avery: 54:19

actually a really good point because she ends up partnering up with the one other girl around her age. And the girl asks her well, why did you pick me? And she says, I don't know. You seem like somebody I could trust. Yeah,

Rosey: 54:29

because you seem like me. Yeah, I see you and me and so I feel safe there.

Avery: 54:33

Yeah, yeah. People started aligning that way in the game. The strongest teams oh, gee, what do you whom does which other team members do not seem able as easily to do is identify individual strengths and other people that are not like him?

Rosey: 54:46

There are so many studies prove that is what needs to happen. Yeah, like the diversity needs to happen.

Avery: 54:54

They have a really good little group and the Pakistani immigrant, the old man, the girl for North Korea. they're really smart guy. Yeah. Is their group for a while, and they do really well until the the games force them to kill each other.

Rosey: 55:07

Yeah. I mean, I mean, they talked about that specifically with work quite a bit like how diverse you need it to be. And that's like with leadership as well, obviously, there's not a diverse leader ship group, if that's even, we want to call the like, owners or people betting on this game. But I feel like that comes up all the time, like, so when we really say like, oh, it's all like women in charge, like, cool, but I don't it can't be all one group. Right in charge. Yeah. Like, even if it was all an underrepresented group, like all non binary people of color. Yeah, that like, yeah, some of them, we need to lift a lot of people out. But we'd still it's a monolith. Yeah.

Avery: 55:47

Oh, yeah.

Rosey: 55:48

That's not the right word.

Avery: 55:49

That's not the right word. Because people of all one thing are not a monolith.

Rosey: 55:53

It's like that fall into a specific quote, unquote, category that you would categorize one way. I mean, you wouldn't even be able to categorize someone's non binary, because you can't see that necessarily. We're going down a different road. But like, just saying like that diversity does make a huge difference and would make you more because you're literally have more knowledge. Now. You're stronger.

Avery: 56:11

You're stronger. Yeah, yeah. More more. Yeah, more knowledge. The one character I did not like at all, could not stand her is this like, low class woman who just like, she sleeps with the gangster guy, which is fine. But there's like a lot of slut shaming going on around her, like people are calling her a slight left and right. She's just like, super manipulative, and like loud. And it's always like, she's just, she's so mean to other people. And everybody hates her that nobody pairs up with her in that game, because they think that she's just going to be murdered. But of course, she's not. And she gets to come back. So that woman is an interesting character, because I guess there was some controversy about how her lines were translated, it turned out that it was like, whatever a whole thing, you can Google it. But what I didn't get at all while I was watching the show is that she's poor. She's supposed to be low class. Like she came from an environment where she couldn't. She was driven to crime. She was driven to manipulation into losing using her sexuality, because she didn't have any other options. And I didn't get that I just thought she was a fucking annoying Grata got it? That's an example of something that didn't come through in the translation. But that game that brings me to what I really think this show is a critique of, which is class. Yeah. I don't think it's really saying that there's one political system that works better than another or that there's one economic system that works better than another. I think what it's really coming out against is ranking people based on class. And it's showing all classes related to all these things, like the color of your skin, or how much money you make, but ultimately, it's how people treat each other and their impressions of each other. And stereotypes and prejudice.

Rosey: 58:00

Is classism. Hum in Britain, is that something that is a problem in Korea. So as far as we know, or we don't know,

Avery: 58:10

I did some research into it, not a ton. So somebody message us if you have more information. It seems like yes, but it's kind of invisible. Yeah. Like people don't talk about it. Because on paper so prosperous. It's a democracy. It's a capitalist society. It's supposedly a great place to live. And it will seem I mean, don't get me wrong, Korea seems great. But it just seems like there's a lot of stuff under the surface that they haven't really been talking about. That is there. I want to the last thing I want to tell you about though, is the Creator. I don't know how to I don't know how to say this. I tried looking it up. Somebody told me that I'm wrong. But his name as an American would say is Wong don't look, I think. Um, so he went to Seoul National National University, which is really interesting, because it's the it's specifically where the highly educated character goes, Okay, call it out multiple times. So I guess it's like a big deal. He went there when he was younger for his undergrad. And then he went to USC University of Southern California for his MFA in film production. And that is a huge like, churn. They churn out industry directors. Okay. So he came from Korea, but he was trained classically in the United States, which is where I think a lot of that Hollywood influence comes from. He made a bunch of other things. And then he was working on squid again, like we said, for like, 10 plus years. And finally, it was picked up by Netflix because they were looking for markets outside the US and he wrote, directed. Yeah, he wrote and directed the whole thing himself. Every episode. He said he lost six teeth. Thank you guys.

Rosey: 1:00:00

saw they just fell out. It just fell out. She

Avery: 1:00:05

Okay, he was like if they make a season to like I might consult.

Rosey: 1:00:10

Yeah. Oh my god. Yes. Don't come back if you're an adult. No, you just don't have them now. No, those

Avery: 1:00:16

are adult teeth that are just gone. Okay. Sorry. But sorry, Viva we appreciate your dedication. I think it's interesting because he was trained in America. He's a Korean director. He's applying American start, like American art forms to a Korean culture, which is now being transmitted back to America, because we are watching that culture. So it's just like this huge, like back and forth mirror effect. And the globalization of art is really interesting to me.

Rosey: 1:00:45

Yeah, that's fascinating. It makes no I mean, and it also makes sense, just given his story. Yeah. Okay, I have one question. That's, I mean, it's related to swinging, but it's slightly off topic from what we've talked about so far. Yeah, I'm gonna go for it. I feel like I have a hard time with dubbing. Like as I get thrown off, so I was gonna ask just what was that? Like? Do you recommend people watch it anyway? Like you get used to it? Or is it? What was your experience watching that?

Avery: 1:01:17

So this was the best job that I've ever seen. I agree. I typically do not like dubbing like a bunch of random people on the internet getting angry about it, like random people don't want to do and did all these videos about it. And then someone pointed out that they were actually looking at the closed captions, not the subtitles. Oh, which are two different things. Yes. So subtitles are translations of the actual dialogue. But even that they need to keep it to less than two lines. So often, sometimes nuance and cultural stuff is taken out of it. Closed Caption is literally exactly what is on screen. And it's sometimes includes even like set noises and stuff, because it's for people that are hard of hearing. Yep. And then dubbing is the English word, like the English version of the script. But the thing about dubbing is that the lines have to fit the same amount of time that are in the person's like the person is speaking. And sometimes I noticed that they were picking words that actually looked like the way that the person's lips were moving. So a lot of times the job is like very different than the actual dialogue. I think in this case, the dub for this show worked really well for me. I think the voice cast cast was really well done. And I got the gist. I also watched the English version with English subtitles, so the subtitles related back to the Korean script. Got it, the dubbing was American. So I would notice sometimes that the subtitles had a slightly different meaning or were slightly more like specific than the dub, and I recommend that I think you should watch it with the American dubbing and with the actual subtitles, not closed caption.

Rosey: 1:02:53

Okay, that's helpful. I think that's good, because even though you just told me everything that happens, it's still intriguing.

Avery: 1:03:00

It was still in five. Yeah, right. I'm sure there's other stuff that's interesting about the dubbing to like the the accents that they chose. So everybody in the show has an American accent except for the old guy. He has a Korean accent. He's speaking American and has a Korean accent. Yeah, right.

Rosey: 1:03:17

Yeah, fascinating. Well, thanks for watching. And walking us through 5% of this good game and hearing that much about it from you was fascinating. I loved the way you thought about it. I thought you did a very good job recapping. Thank you and walking us through that. So I mean up to you now folks, because you've heard everything basically Well, apparently not. But you know, the major points if you watch it and have a differing opinion or the same opinion, let us know.

Avery: 1:03:46

Please do there's so much free will read like pages

Rosey: 1:03:49

and pages so sad whatever.

Avery: 1:03:58

Okay, so now we're gonna head back to Netflix to look at the top 10 streaming for this week. We are in the it's soon to be third week of October. We were surprised because honestly, I've never really paid attention to the top 10 on Netflix until we did this podcast and we kind of thought it wouldn't be changing that quickly. And it's changed a lot since our last episode so we're gonna take a look now

Rosey: 1:04:23

jumping right in number one is squid gaze, which you've heard all our thoughts and feelings about all of a real deep dive analysis it's also very watchable.

Avery: 1:04:33

Yeah, like even if if you think you won't like squid game I think you should try you the listener should try at least the first episode and see what you think.

Rosey: 1:04:41

Okay, challenge extended. I was gonna say accepted but I'm not willing to excel. Okay, number two is made. I've seen the trailer for this a couple and I Id made Yes. Smart. Good. Yeah. Okay. The description is after fleeing an abusive relationship, a young mother finds a job cleaning houses as she fights to provide for her child and build them a better future. Sounds like pursuit of happiness. It does a little except I mean, we I don't know, like the whole background but just from the image like the little girls like a little white blonde thing. And, I mean, she looks white as well. I don't know her whole story. This is like looks up my alley because it looks like sort of feel good. Can't tell what the energy's exactly going to be.

Avery: 1:05:30

It's definitely weepy, though.

Rosey: 1:05:32

It does look maybe it's gray. It looks very gray. Okay, we're going to go into trailer number one.

Unknown: 1:05:46

What you're working on. It's a story about a woman

Rosey: 1:05:52

on the couch, writing in a journal, now you're just seeing her with her little girl on the beach. She lives in

Avery: 1:05:57

a big New York Times bestselling memoir. Oh, that's interesting scenes. She's been doing all the cleaning,

Rosey: 1:06:08

like deep cleaning like toothbrush in the graduating

Avery: 1:06:13

class be? Visibly everything she's saying is the opposite of entire Saturday's Yeah,

Rosey: 1:06:18

she's like a very working class life Hearthstone. Yeah.

Avery: 1:06:24

And reading her first submission books. Some sort of legal documents,

Rosey: 1:06:30

seems to be her mom. She's raising her daughter to her mother.

Avery: 1:06:35

She's the luxury of time producers of shameless. She wakes up every morning to view the ocean.

Rosey: 1:06:44

I mean, obviously, this is the point of the trailer, but it's literally the opposite of her world handy

Unknown: 1:06:49

big seven pies from scratch. She wants to

Rosey: 1:06:54

she's I was thought there's a lot of conflict in her world. Oh my God.

Avery: 1:07:03

There is a meeting on

Rosey: 1:07:07

her dream is literally the opposite of her life. Yeah.

Avery: 1:07:12

Which is a good illustration of like, she's describing an upper class woman's life. Like it's not just a dream. That is true. She's describing the

Rosey: 1:07:20

I'm like seeing the reality. Yeah, class disparity. Coming back. Big

Avery: 1:07:25

thing in America right now.

Rosey: 1:07:29

Do you think you'll watch it? I don't know. Like, I'm, maybe I'll start it. I don't know that. I'm going to commit to the whole thing. Yeah, it's a limited series, but it feels like it'll depend a lot on like, are those actors engaging? Like, just that trailer? I was like, Yeah, wasn't

Avery: 1:07:46

it so funny? Because like things like squid game or like, really gory stuff people are like, oh, like you were even saying yeah, I don't know if I could watch that. Or if I could handle that like moral dilemma would be too hard. Emotionally for ya Allah. I have more trouble with like things like this, like made or like, did you ever see room? I didn't know. God was there. I'm terrified these these shows about like, oppressed women and children and like, terrible situations are like that's, that's my gore.

Rosey: 1:08:14

Yeah, I mean, that's harder. And that's like more real. Yeah, it's not a metaphor it like is

Avery: 1:08:20

and to your point earlier about, like, how much should we be doing the work by watching these things? Like really? I should. I shouldn't just be ignoring these things like some need there. They are also important that they need to be looked at. They need to be seen.

Rosey: 1:08:33

Okay, there's a heavy episode. Yeah. Okay, this number three is on my block. The fourth season just came out of this show. Very different energy. It says for the genre romantic TV drama. What are romantic TV comedy, it looks like a comedy. I mean, we have not seen this. The description is in a rough Los Angeles neighborhood for smart, funny and streetwise teens find their lifelong friendship tested as they begin high school. So that's interesting, too, if this is season four. I mean, are they seniors? Like, there's like 10 episodes this season. I mean, that's a lot of episodes. That's like interesting that it would be trending, you know, still season four because Season Three seems to be about when shows stop loss. Yeah,

Avery: 1:09:17

that's interesting. Would you watch it honestly, to me looks like the American Hispanic version of sex education like it has a similar I can see

Rosey: 1:09:23

that I can see that. I don't know if I'd watch it. Honestly, I watch a lot teen stuff. I'm slightly interested in the fact that it's a different kind of neighborhood. Like that's why really like Never have I ever because what's that? It's Mindy Kaling show and they're the main characters in Indian teenage girl highly recommend. I actually wish I had brought up Never Have I Ever more in our conversation last week, but I forgot.

Avery: 1:09:47

We had so much dogma. I think we gave you guys enough. Yeah.

Rosey: 1:09:50

All right. Number four is Dave Chappelle. I have not watched much Chappelle. I remember watching a little bit with my brother. Like I feel like he's just gonna make me feel bad. But maybe I'll make me laugh. I don't know it says it. Oh, as he closes out his slate of comedy specials, Dave takes the stage to try and set the record straight and get a few things off his chest.

Avery: 1:10:11

So this is a direct response to his last special where he said some weird stuff about trans people.

Rosey: 1:10:18

Yeah, I don't know. I don't know

Avery: 1:10:21

about that I've never been. I think he's funny. And I think he was groundbreaking, but I've never been a huge fan of him. His whole thing. His whole career, though, has been trouble with people receiving his jokes in the way he intended them. Like the reason he quit his show in the first place is that he said, he realized why people were laughing at his jokes for the wrong reasons. Oh, yeah, that's interesting. And then he left and like went to Africa.

Rosey: 1:10:45

So like intent and impact perception. He's he Yeah,

Avery: 1:10:51

I think he assumes a level of maturity or like, a baseline understanding with his audience isn't necessarily there.

Rosey: 1:11:00

That's interesting. It doesn't make me want to watch it, but it makes me want to like read more. Okay, number five, there's someone inside your house. 2021. We're gonna watch a trailer while leaning into this one. Yeah, it looks like you know, it's a horror movie for sure. makhani and her friends at Osborne High School tried to identify and stop a masked killer who's targeting students and exposing their biggest secrets. This is like

Avery: 1:11:28

updated scream. What is this called? There's someone inside your house. So that's literally the iconic line from the first scene of Scream. Oh, so

Rosey: 1:11:37

maybe it is because there's also a show that they did a few years ago called scream. Oh, really? That is, like built off of that.

Avery: 1:11:46

Screen as a great movie. Yes. If you haven't seen that yet. You're missing

Rosey: 1:11:49

out. Okay, we're gonna watch the trailer. Looks pretty obvious here. Good kid field.

Avery: 1:11:57

Corn in the USA. We're in Midwest. Football black girl in the Midwest with a white prom date.

Unknown: 1:12:04

You had no relationship with Jackson

Avery: 1:12:09

looks like her prom date is dead. That she's being interviewed by the police.

Rosey: 1:12:15

Who wakes up from an egg clock Oh, he doesn't he didn't mean to do he doesn't know what this is.

Avery: 1:12:23

Oh, the egg clock was not his alarm. No. Well, someone else out there probably someone inside the house. There's pictures everywhere. Oh, you're gonna die. Oh my God. He was in a walk in closet and a knife came out of the clothes. Oh my god, and now he's dead. Oh, let's call from the people that did the conjuring.

Rosey: 1:12:42

And Stranger Things took me on the field of lie but there's certain fireballs and paradox about

Avery: 1:12:47

this music is definitely got Stranger Things vibes makes sense. You know?

Rosey: 1:12:51

Why would the only note there's some other people of color. Crazy people in this town?

Avery: 1:12:56

I have a secret. I accidentally ran over here. Walking around.

Rosey: 1:13:01

This is supposed to be present day. Oh, yeah, they have cell phones. There's some pills all over for

Avery: 1:13:12

Oh my god. Okay, so all the lights went out at this house party and they just got murder. spray painted on the lockers, lockers. Bonfires. They're hurting all the teen tropes.

Rosey: 1:13:27

Yeah. And all the horror tropes. Yeah. Maybe it's a good combo of both secret secrets. That keeps popping up on the screen open up in the car, but they'll probably die. You know my secret there someone inside your house

Avery: 1:14:00

wearing a basketball face and he's forcing you to record she said in a speech oh my god, she was hiding in the closet.

Rosey: 1:14:10

Don't go into closets. None of these people should go into the closet.

Avery: 1:14:13

Don't go into a place that you can't get out. You need a backdoor one

Rosey: 1:14:16

thing no one gets out alive did a good job. If she didn't walk down the scary hallways. She just looked at them and then we'll go back to her room. She sounds like she was smarter. Yeah. Okay, would you watch that?

Avery: 1:14:30

I don't know. Like maybe I probably should have because I love those horror movies and like the late 90s Like the faculty and screen we just talked about like all those teen horror movies. I fucking love. It'd be interesting to watch and compare. Yeah, it was doing a lot though. It may be doing too much. Yeah. This one I am so excited about number six is the guilty which is the Jake new Jake Gyllenhaal movie. I'm fucking in love with him. And always ever since. Um Nightcrawler I was like, Oh, this Nightcrawler

Rosey: 1:15:02

made me never want to see this. We saw that movie together. Did we in LA? Yeah. So I know nothing about this. Aside from that, it's about honestly don't

Avery: 1:15:11

watch. Don't read anything. Just watch the trailer and we're probably not going to talk through this 1911

Unknown: 1:15:19

emergency operator 625 What is the address of the emergency? Sorry, called 911. I just want to talk to you. Okay. Sweetie, okay. So what do you really? Okay, well, I'm gonna ask you yes or no questions? Is the person who would have a weapon? I don't know. Have you been abducted?

Rosey: 1:15:43

Yes. Does it it just look awesome. Nope. I will not watch that movie. Will you watch it? You let us know. I will watch it. I think the reason I didn't it doesn't like grip me. Well, first of all, I've heard so many stories of that, like that happening. People calling in pretending they're ordering pizza. Terrified and first and putting together something else going on. There's also a show called 911. And it's Connie Britton, who's the 911 operator. And almost that exact same storyline happens for her as well. She helps someone who's been abducted into so I think I feel like I've seen it. But I mean, he's so good. I can't imagine. You know, I'm sure there's like a bunch of new stuff coming from this depiction of that. Yeah. Because his personality seems to be a huge piece of it. Like how he like that. You mentioned, like he feels like he's just like, I'm above this.

Avery: 1:16:33

That is a Jake Gyllenhaal. Yeah. I don't think I could be a 911 operate.

Rosey: 1:16:40

I don't think I could do that. My friend also tight like who watched the first episode? Hi, Taylor. Hey, Jay said. Like, if you look at it again, the guilty is on there. And I just watched it and he would talk about it. So like, tell us what you think, Taylor.

Avery: 1:16:53

I wonder what the training is like to be an unknown operator.

Rosey: 1:16:57

It's gotta be really intense, cuz there's got to be a bunch of stuff you're listening for. That isn't just like what the person is saying. Both that like they call and think it's more serious than maybe it is because you have to be triaging of like, well, you're not about to die. So like the ambulance will show up. But it's not, you know, and then something like that, where you're like, hang on, I heard something in the background and like to me about your tone was, but you gotta be making the decision. Just like so fast. Yeah, no, thank

Avery: 1:17:22

you. The emotional boundaries to like to be able to compartmentalize, that's probably

Rosey: 1:17:26

why he's decent at it, though, that he's just like, Okay, bye. Okay, they're coming. Okay. Like,

Avery: 1:17:32

have you ever call 911? No, have you? Yeah. Called once? Yeah. I was surprised by how cold they were. Yeah,

Rosey: 1:17:40

I'm a must. I mean, like, the other thing is, if you're making assumptions, but if you're calling about an emergency, they've heard your emergency before. Like, I highly doubt it's the first time they've heard it's the first time it's happening for you. But they're like, Yeah, I get calls about someone with a knife or I get calls about like, my dad's not breathing. Like I've heard this. I'll do the thing. That's next on my list. Good luck.

Avery: 1:18:04

It's just so interesting, though. Do you think of like, hospital workers too, because there's Yes. To perform your job? Well, it makes sense why you would have to not be emotional or empathetic about it. But on the other hand, the person that's asking for help, often the thing like that they need as much as the help is to be for the emotion to be reflected back to calm down.

Rosey: 1:18:27

So seven is midnight mass. Which we know how every feels. I'm not going to jump in, although I like some of the actors. We talked

Avery: 1:18:36

about last time. I have had a lot of people tell me I'm wrong. That's interesting. Yeah, like friends. Yeah. Yeah. So please, please write in with with all the things you tell us about

Rosey: 1:18:47

us. Agreed. Agreed. Plus one. Okay, eight. Fascinating. I wonder if it just came on to Netflix is Titanic.

Avery: 1:18:55

Finally, we've waited so long Netflix.

Rosey: 1:19:01

I have actually only seen this movie maybe twice. It's like not my favorite movie so long. It's very long. Yeah,

Avery: 1:19:07

it had two VHS tapes, remember? Yeah,

Rosey: 1:19:10

I do. It's three hours and 14 minutes. It'd be kind of interesting to watch it again. But it's a lot of time in Cameron. What's his face? If you watch it again and come up with a reason that you're like, you should look back into this. You let us know. I mean, I can't get over the SEC, they would have both fit at the end on the board could have fit on the headboard or whatever.

Avery: 1:19:30

But to be fair, just because you physically would fit on that board. It might have still sunk

Rosey: 1:19:34

I agree also, are their brains functioning they just went through a trauma that is like unfathomable to me.

Avery: 1:19:41

And and arguably he's gonna die anyway, like he's

Rosey: 1:19:46

survived twice. So I don't disagree with you. But the visual from above was infuriating to look at because I was like, it feels he could have it. But although again, he could have fit could he physically move his body up? Right, like he was done, and

Avery: 1:20:01

if we're gonna do the thing that we do on the show, which is look at it from a cultural standpoint, she was rich and he was poor. Yeah. So

Rosey: 1:20:08

yeah, so All right, that reason to

Avery: 1:20:11

watch this again is Kate Winslet and to a slightly lesser extent, Leo

Rosey: 1:20:16

yeah he's not even on the image is of Kate and that other guy.

Avery: 1:20:20

Oh that's funny it's not even of I thought that was him from Firefly even

Rosey: 1:20:24

him. Leo's not even in the picture he's not in this cover image either fascinating Caitlin's though you still have a watch mayor of you so I'm writing it down. Write it down. You

Avery: 1:20:33

gotta watch that shit is a fucking living legend.

Rosey: 1:20:37

Okay, number nine is cocoa melon. Yeah, that's wrong. I hope that stays up there forever.

Avery: 1:20:42

Did you see in the show notes from last episode, where I put the stat of 700 million views on the cocoa melon video? No, it's just like a random one on YouTube. 700 million views?

Rosey: 1:20:58

Well, the thing is with a kid or anyone who's hanging out with a kid, they just watch it again. They don't even really seem to have no recognize they have seen it already. Yeah, there's some watching it again, like it's new. Sometimes we'll be like, this is the part where blah, blah, blah, blah. But oftentimes, they're just like, mesmerized. It's like you've given them drugs.

Avery: 1:21:17

Do you remember being a kid when like you were just so in the moment that you could just watch the same thing over and over and it didn't get boring? Like I'm trying to provide that I like can really miss just being delighted every time I feel like later

Rosey: 1:21:31

if I tell Charlie, you remember watching cocoa melon? He's five when he's 10. He'll be like not really. And I'm like, Do you know how much like my siblings will give me they're much older, so they'll give much they're gonna hate that. nine and seven years older. They watched a lot of Barney with me. I have a very vague memory of watching that show at all. Yeah, they had to watch it endlessly. I actually have the exact

Avery: 1:21:55

same thing with my aunt. I mean, my watch Barney with me. And she was like, I literally was gonna kill that fucking stuff.

Rosey: 1:22:02

Yeah. And I'm like, Oh, I don't remember that thing. So yes.

Avery: 1:22:06

Like at all like, I remember the cleanup song. And that's it.

Rosey: 1:22:09

I remember the cleanup. And I love the song. I don't remember that. And I kind of there's a yellow dinosaur. Yeah, it sounds so funny anyway. And the number 10 to round it out is the duff this was on Hulu, which I happen to know. So I don't know if it's up here because it just moved to Netflix. But it is a teen rom com with Mae Whitman. And Robbie and Mel. It's like, fine. I mean, I've watched a lot of rom coms and teen comedies. I don't it's not. I don't recommend

Avery: 1:22:42

it. If Rosie doesn't. If you're not into it. It's

Rosey: 1:22:47

not worth your time. There's multiple scenes, it feels outdated. It feels like it's from 2015 I would have said it was from like 2004 Like it's behind it, which is surprising to me because I love Mae and she's very progressive. So I always wonder like, what was the deal? How'd you get? How did you get is she's done to this plot is she's all that she's not she's the duck the duck? Dumb, ugly fat friend.

Avery: 1:23:11

Oh my god, I'm already out. Yeah,

Rosey: 1:23:13

and the whole idea of the movie is like, like, no one should be called the duff. Like everyone has their own like thing to bring to the table, you know, like kind of the same message that we've seen before. But I was like, this is again like there's the Mean Girl Bella Thorne, who's like hot and pretty and is mean and seems to not even like the boy but like keeps wanting the boy because it's good arm candy to have like it it. I don't. I don't like it. The end is there's a dance. And someone's going to be you know, king and queen. And she's made the dress herself out of like, you know, her flannel shirt or something to like, represent the cheese sell herself. But it like is, you know, it's a it's a strapless, low cut like, and then he becomes king. But instead of going up for his crown kisses her in front of everybody. Oh, so

Avery: 1:24:03

he's validating that she's an actual, like, valuable human being.

Rosey: 1:24:07

Yeah. That's Hora and the whole thing is that she's trying to write this paper she can't wrap her head around called What does homecoming mean to me and she like can't do it and then she's able to write it once. Look at a guy's hair sir. Yeah, I heard it's not good. I wouldn't. I've watched so many of those shows. I could give some other kind of list of those types of shows that like do do stuff. Well. Not that one. Don't watch this movie. Don't watch that one. So there's the top 10 And Netflix streaming so Avery is obviously going to watch the guilty pro obviously gonna watch the duff don't watch the DUP. I'm not sure any of these are going to I might watch an episode or two of all my blocks. I'm kind of curious. And again, maybe I'll watch like an episode of made like what's the pile and see but I'm not obsessed. So that's what I am watching though. Yeah, what are you watching is a show from 2018 called a million little things which came Oh, right around the time that this is us came out, I think. So it's a similar like, feeling. I think this is this is better at storytelling like it's jumping in time a lot is what this is this is doing. And also it's more like this isn't sure I was about to say it's a more diverse cast, but I guess it's the same. There's like three people of color in it.

Avery: 1:25:20

How many people is it like an ensemble? It's

Rosey: 1:25:22

an ensemble, the whole premise is that in the first episode, there's this group of four. Well, there's a group of four guy friends, adults, like in their 30s, I guess, late 30s. And their wives are definitely big characters as well. But like, it starts with sort of knowing those four, and there's one of the four in the first half of the pilot jumps off a his balcony only. So the whole show is like them reeling from suicide. No one knew he was the North Star. He was the one that kept everyone together. He was the glue, like the one who had it all to the one who had it all together, the one who was happy, so like they do a good job exploring that mental health. And then the big intent. Well, that's intense. When the first friend who finds out then calls the other friends. One of them has a mouthful of pills and has just finished a note his wife answers the phone, and then spits out the pills. Oh, my God. So the whole first few episodes, I mean, what I owe, and it's so intense. What I like about it, though, is things I won't say they resolve, like, I'm in season two now. And he's, you know, seeing a therapist and on antidepressants. He in the second episode tells his friends, hey, when you called me, this is what I was going through, like it moved at a pace that seemed believable for human adults to be like, this horrible thing happened. We all don't understand how and why we didn't see that our friend was in pain. I'm now going to summon the strength inside of me, which is very hard to do to explain that I'm also in pain.

Avery: 1:26:52

Yeah, it sounds like it treats its care. It lets its characters be smart. Yes,

Rosey: 1:26:57

that's exactly right. So that's what I really like about it. So yeah, I mean, I'm I'm enjoying watching. It's on Hulu, for anyone to jump in. It's old. I'm behind. I think it's still going like I think another season's gonna be coming out this year. I'm curious. I don't know if they work in COVID. Any? Like, I'm watching the season in 2019 right now. So I don't know if 2020 will include that shows are all over the map with how much they include or don't include that. Like as a as a plot. Yeah. Like I was just supposed to be in modern day. Yeah. It's just a modern day. Yeah. So it's really interesting. I mean, there's a character. Oh, God, the guy who's in a whose name I don't know the name of the actor. But the only one I while I recognize two of them. But is the guy from psych main guy

Avery: 1:27:39

or the friend?

Rosey: 1:27:40

The main guy? Yeah, the main guy. I can't remember his name on any I can't remember his name in any game in this show. It's his name's Gary. And it's a drama. It's a drama.

Avery: 1:27:52

He's like, it's so silly.

Rosey: 1:27:54

He's my favorite. I can't tell if that's because I already knew him and like, have a weird, like, you seem familiar. But yeah, so highly recommend. They let them be smart. They all like even there was a moment where there's about to be this weird custody battle. And you were like, just speak to each other, like, what is happening, and a friend ends up hearing both sides. And it's like, I think we all just need to talk and like, get out all the time. It was like really nice. There. The people are so upset with each other, which is again, normal and human and adult but like, you're really going to sue your friend.

Avery: 1:28:28

So nice.

Rosey: 1:28:30

So yeah, it's good.

Avery: 1:28:31

It's so good. When shows do that too. And it's such it's such a lazy writing to like not let your characters be smart and think that you're not going to have a source of like, plot if you don't do that. I agreed. That's like a that's a trope of or rule of improv, like you're supposed to always do the thing that someone says you're supposed to do it immediately. Yeah, and just see what happens. Yeah,

Rosey: 1:28:52

I think I mean, we talked about that a little bit last time too. But like, just let people be friends with a couple get together. See what happens next. Don't like cut everything off.

Avery: 1:28:59

And even what you were saying earlier about how you felt about no one gets out alive. You're like, Okay, we've done the thing you know, like what's next? For here? Exactly.

Rosey: 1:29:10

Just watching you discover the monsters like

Avery: 1:29:12

Netflix just aren't listening. We want this to be a series.

Rosey: 1:29:17

Anyway, so that's what I'm watching now. Is there anything else you're watching? Are you just going through these?

Avery: 1:29:20

I am watching the chestnut man, which I think it was either. I don't think it was in the top 10 But it was in the trending last night and I had just finished good game and I needed a palate cleanser. This was not a great palette. I just don't man is it's about a serial killer. It's Danish, so it's got kind of that like, that's like a vibe like yeah, a genre now is like those serial killer like European shows. That's good. It's got right now we're kind of trying to see if the serial killer is trying to defend children which is interesting. Based on like who he's picking as his victim, victims, it's good if you're looking for like, if you like that kind of thing and you're looking for something that you can kind of have on the background while you do other stuff on it and the main actors is really good.

Rosey: 1:30:13

Nice. Yeah. I'm good recommends anything else for closing out. Don't think we've gotten this is a heavy episode. Maybe we'll go lighter and then it's good

Avery: 1:30:25

game really took it out of me. I had so many things to say about him. And there's more that can be said.

Rosey: 1:30:32

Yeah. Well, thanks so much for listening everybody.

Avery: 1:30:36

Thank you guys. Episode. Go ahead.

Rosey: 1:30:38

I was gonna say just a reminder if you have any feedback, anything to share that you liked that you didn't like that you want to argue with us about email us at the rift pod@gmail.com

Avery: 1:30:50

Also we're considering starting a voicemail, so you guys could just call and leave your own thoughts and then we would play your actual voice

Rosey: 1:30:57

had us ramble. That's either a pro or con depending on who you are.

Avery: 1:30:59

Well, we'll edit you

Rosey: 1:31:02

to permission um,

Avery: 1:31:04

but if you guys want to see that I mean, it might be coming down the down the pipe. Yeah. And follow

Rosey: 1:31:08

us on Instagram really important fictional things. It's the whole thing written out we are working on the content. So that's gonna come up and then obviously, you can still read our blog on medium. Yep.